11/19/2009: Lisa from Thousand Oaks, Ca, USA replies: "Hi Janie,

Perhaps, you have parasites and the acv and lemon disturbed them which is what all the sudden itching was about. I know it can be used to rid parasites. As for raw, organic honey, there are so many good benefits to it. It might be worth it to see if that is the case and consider getting rid of them. Detoxing is not always a very pleasant experience!"

11/29/2009: Richard from Alpine, Tx. replies: "Dear Janie D.

I never respond or write in forums, chat rooms or to emails for that matter, but yours really got the better of me. You mention that you read that Honey is bad for you or, that at least it's bad affects out weigh it's benefits. That can't be right. Are you sure that it isn't instead, that you don't like honey? You see I have always liked honey even though my family did not use it when I was growing up. We were always a straight white sugar family. My mother and sister have suffered horrible health since their mid to late twenties. I have always been a bit of a health nut and was the one in the family more inclined to read up on healthy alternatives and then gravitate towards them. Such as whole wheat over white bread and flax ground up in my oatmeal instead of box cerial, or juice and tea instead of soda and koolaid, or natural peanut butter over the crappy fake stuff, etc. But still even after I left home I did not really buy much honey because it was expensive and less convienient than sugar, also I was not really sure how to use it in all the same ways as regular sugar. But in my mid twenties I became addicted to it's use in my hot beverages and also as a wonderful combination with peanut butter on bread or bananas. Then in my early mid thirties I moved to the country and decided to try raising honey-bees. As you can imagine, I began to read alot about honey and it's benefits to health, both real and imagined. I read about royal jelly and bee pollin and mead. I read about burn clinics and how honey is being used more today in treating burn victoms than it was fifty years ago because science has not been able to improve on it's hydroscopic and anti-bacterial properties. It apparently is one of the best wound mediums for the regrowth of human tissue. Honey it turns out is not "just" sugar. There are many other constituent nutrients in sugar and it metabolizes differently from sugar. Honey is not processed if your buying natural, raw, organic, or local honey. I know every bee keeper in my politacally conservative area of Texas and none of them use chemicals or heat their honey or pastuerize. There are no additives or colors or flavor enhancers and unlike sugar it is not bleached. Todays folks are lucky to get "real" sugar since everything is sweetened in this country with corn syrup which according to my research is much worse for human long term health than is granulated cane or beet sugar. So my point here is simply this! I have spent hundreds of hours searching the net and books and magazines on the subject of health and honey and can't recall a single authoritative article doubting the numerous benefits of Honey. I find it difficult to believe that you did some reading on the subject, only to find that it is not all that good for you. I would be greatly interested to know your source material. I would like to remind every one that honey is one of the oldest known foods consumed by humans. And that since the 1500s honey has been a food source found in nearly every region of the Earth. I can think of no food that has been subject to as much scrutiny and bonafide medical research as is honey. With the exception of feeding honey to infants under one year of age, I have never read deleterious reports on honey and human health but only the numerous benefits.

One classic book on the subject is the medical Doctor Bodog F. Beck's "Honey and Health". This particular book is 250 pages of factual info on honey and health with some of the writings being borrowed from the ancient Greeks and Romans. But I am a firm believer that proof is in seeing. What I have seen over the last twenty-five years is that those people who consume refined sugar and sodas and high fructose corn sweetened products have poor health at best and disease at worst. Those people I have known for 25 years or more who eat honey, molases, sorghum etc, seem to be in wonderful health with no use of pharmacueticals and no excess weight. Yes I realise that whole health is related more to a total life style change and a lifetime habit of health, but I also know that, that habit is more likely to start with the simple choices one makes such as in choice of sweeteners. Did you know that an article printed in Mens Health magazine a few years ago stated that a recent medical study in the middle east indicated that blood sugar levels in subjects fed honey actually decreased. The article was talking about the possible eventual use of honey for diabetic patients.

I apoligize to everyone for being preachy. And no I do not sell honey or make a living from it in any way, but I do come from a family that struggles with weight issues and poor health and know that I eat a pint of raw honey every week to two weeks and am five feet elevin and weigh 165 pounds and at 44 years of age have never had a prescription filled or spent a day in a hospital and can out run my nephews even though I don't work out, or work at it. I also don't have cavities.

I do want to state that it is possible you were having a reaction to your honey with the itching you described. I'm not denying that possibility. The plants visited in the area by the bees that produced the honey you ate might be something you are very allergic too. Switching to another honey from another area, or harvested at a differnt time of year might do the trick. Otherwise you might have a test done to get to the bottom of what causes such a reaction."

11/29/2009: Lisa from Thousand Oaks, Ca, USA replies: "Dear Richard, You shouldn't apologize- you have very good points. I happen to agree and know that honey, bee pollen and royal jelly are gifts to this planet. Honey is a very powerful food and is full of enzymes which help us tremendously. Thanks for your input and perhaps your info will help someone out there. Sincerely, Lisa"

11/30/2009: Janie D from Mattoon, Illinois replies: "Hi Richard... You can read the article about "Honey" at http:/healthandlight.com/TheMasterCleanse.pdf Look on page 11. It comes from a book on "The Master Cleanse". after reading this, I am a little leary about eating any more honey!"

11/30/2009: T from Maryland, Usa replies: "Janie: never take one source's word for anything (that includes here - and me!). The PDF you linked to has the line "It [honey] is deficient in calcium and has many detrimental effects on the human being". It should take far more than one vague, unsubstantiated statement to make up your mind on something. Exactly what are these "many detrimental effects"? And where is the evidence of them?

Honey has been used for thousands of years and its uses and benefits have been extensively documented across a number of cultures. Ayurveda uses honey in some remedies. Just for the sake of argument, if I were to take just one bit of information to go on as you did, that would do it for me, because a lot of what is used in Ayurveda is now being proven to do just what that 5,000 years old system of medicine claims.

The PDF goes on to say "According to one authority..." What authority? Why don't they name them? Where are the references that any legitimate, responsible writer would include? Many writers are skilled at sneaking this kind of fudging in to convey the impression that they are authoritative and have some sort of backing for their statements. I have been finding this to be particularly true in the "alternative" health field, which is quite sad since it tarnishes this valuable field which already faces enough battles. Never forget that critical thinking is a NECESSITY, especially when it comes to taking health recommendations from any source. Examine all, research all, question all.

Here's a start on some more responsible information on honey for you. Unlike your PDF writer, this one actually lists sources and studies to back up the statements made:

http://www.whfoods.com/genpage.php?tname=foodspice&dbid=96

Richard, you said "I never respond or write in forums, chat rooms or to emails for that matter..." I hope you will reconsider as I found your post very interesting. You have contributions to make - don't be afraid to jump in and make them :)"

12/01/2009: Dr. Shaheen from New York, Ny replies: "I have never read a more bias and intentionaly manipulative article/book on "Honey" and its effects then the one I say in the book mentioned by Janie D. For starters the book starts by saying " Honey must not be used at any time internally."(page 11) what does he realy mean by "internally" ??!! notice also, he did not say consumed. He is trying to avoid a big law suit for misleading the readers. "Internally" here refers to the use of honey in a syringe or in an operational dressing, since it has not been pasturized, which of course is true of any such natural product. You get the gist of it .... etc."

12/08/2009: Janie D from Mattoon, Illinois, USA replies: "I actually LOVE eating honey and had been eating it throughout the years (in place of sugar) and never, ever had any problems with eating it. It was always regular store bought pure honey that I had been eating (made in the area at local bee farms). About four months ago I switched my brand after reading that "organic" honey would be better for you. I was eating it practically every day (no differant that how/when I ate the "pure" honey).I had it with a rice cake, had it on my oatmeal, had it with peanut butter. I gradually started to develope severe itching everywhere on my body, I try to listen to my body, and tried to think of things that I had recently done differantly that may be causing this problem (it came down to my laundry soap, my body scrub and the organic honey). Well, it got to the (organic) honey and after eliminating it from my food diet, my itching started to disappear. I now have no more itching. I did go back to eating it again to see if I would have a reaction and it did.

With-in two days of eating the (organic) honey, I started itching... again. Do you think I might be allergic to the organic as apposed to the pure honey and maybe the location of the honey has something to do with it, since I had been eating locally grown pure honey all these years and then switched to organic (although both come from the state of Illinois) ? I did try eating the "pure" honey again and so far (it's been three days since I ate the pure honey)and I have no problem with itching. Our bodies are all differant and maybe with mine, I have built up a tollerance to eating the pure honey only. I am not disputing that honey could be bad,as I love honey, but I am wondering why now, my body is reacting to it with the itching. This is why I am on a quest to research honey and read everything I know about it. Is there something in my body that is not able to handle the "organic" type of honey compared to the "pure" honey, and what/why? Thank you for your input. Janie D."

01/06/2010: Ivory Coast from Loco, Ca replies: "YOU KNOW ORGANIC MEANS THAT THE GROWER CANOT PUT ANYTHING DOWN TO KILL A PEST. THUS, IT COULD BE THAT THAT PARTICULAR HONEY IS INFECTED WITH SOMETHING. IT WOULD BE INTERESTING TO SEE IF ANOTHER BRAND OF ORGANIC HONEY DID THE SAMETHING. OR IF THE HONEY COULD BE TESTED TO SEE WHAT IS IN IT. IN OTHER WORDS ARE THERE ANY TOXINS IN IT OR DOES ANYTHING GROW WHEN SOME OF THE HONEY IS PLACED ON A STERILE PETRIE DISH. I DON'T KNOW HOW THEY TREAT REGULAR HONEY. IS IT PASTERIZED?"

[YEA]  01/27/2011: Honey from Midway City, Ca replies: "First and foremost, I thoroughly enjoyed reading this entire thread! Everyone's input and advice and expertise were very informative and non-critical or judgmental. I love how you are all here to help each other. KUDOS to Richard, Lisa, T, Dr. Shaheen, Ivory Coast AND Janie D!

This thread has made me want to throw out any and all products made with artificial sweeteners and or refined sugar and only use Raw Organic Honey for everything! I believe Honey is Liquid Gold, Serum from God, Nature's Miracle Elixir. I also believe that the old adage, "An apple a day, keeps the Doctor away" is true! Thus, the many healthy benefits of ACV! Apples have to be the ultimate fruit in the Garden of Eden!

I want to suggest to Janie D, or reiterate what Richard and one other said about the pollens and antigens from allergens that honey bees are exposed to.

Raw Organic Honey works like a vaccine. It exposes the body to a small amount of the allergen which is too small to cause a reaction to the individual whom has a particular allergy to that pollen. (There are significantly fewer spores in the honey, compared to sniffing a flower or plant directly.)

The cause of your itching could be that the particular honey that you are eating has significantly higher amounts of the particular trigger that you are allergic to. However, this reaction of severe itching is a rather severe reaction to an allergy and I would definitely suggest getting tested by an allergist.

The test is fairly simple. You go in to the office, lie on your stomach and the Practitioner will write approximately 60 numbers on your back. They will then drop a single drop of each different plant based reactor on your back and slightly scratch your skin. (This is more of a tickle than a prick, since they do not have to break the skin for it to react. ) They also put a control drop in a separate area on your back, which will definitely positively react with your skin. They will wait 20 minutes and come back to see which number reacts and that is what you are allergic to! I guarantee it will be the plant that was visited by the honey bees that produced the organic honey that you are reacting to! Problem solved.

Solution, DO NOT GIVE UP HONEY! Find another brand of Organic Honey, or stick to Raw honey. The only difference is Organic honey must be produced, processed and packaged in a way that follows the regulations for organic guidelines. Natural honey is produced using traditional methods. Both are good.

Raw honey is the best, it has not been pasteurized, filtered or heated. Pasteurization is Americas way of making the Honey 'pretty & smooth' by overheating it. Thus, removing the honey's natural capability to crystallize (which is not a bad thing, meaning, crystallized honey is GOOD! ) Pasteurization also removes many of the natural enzymes, antibodies and antigens that honey is known for it's positive benefits. America has a weird thing with ruining natural foods, like milk, oats, wheat, flour, sugar, etc. by over-processing it.

Just try raw, natural, organic, (even crystallized) honey. To make it pour better, heat the 'glass jar' that it should come in, in hot water. (NOT MICROWAVE! )

HTH!

~Erin, a Honey advocate!"

06/29/2011: Cj from Orlando, Fl replies: "Itching may come from yeast infection caused by ACV not Honey (especially in hot areas under arms between legs)."

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